Good skills, never picked

[Raveen]

The article that nj found about the good skill synergies and picks got me thinking. There are some skills that coaches almost never pick but that are really good on players that start with them.

Dump Off is a good example. If you're building a thrower you want Pass, Accurate, Sure Hands, Safe Throw, Blodge. If you're building a runner then Sure Hands, Blodge, fend is the way to go. In neither case will you ever pick Dump Off but on the Dark Elf runner it's really good.

Any others?

[Gandalf]

Foul Appearance / Disturbing Presence on the Nurgle Warriors. Apparently they used to be one skill which made it more pick-worthy, but since they got split they are rarely chosen.

[lawastooshort]

I don't know. Nerves of Steel on the Elf catchers is excellent, but I'd probably never give up a double for it on other catcher types.

But then I don't think I've ever built a catcher type as a scorer. I don't know if I'd ever give it to a thrower, either.

[Gandalf]

I would absolutely take it on a Wood Elf Catcher. It's tempting for a ball-retriever too - dive in, pick it up in tackle zones & then throw it away to a team-mate in the clear... saves having to dodge out, if you even have any movement left. Works even better with Big Hand.

[lawastooshort]

Hmm, that's a good reasoning which I can't fault.

The thing is I am only really thinking from the point of view of my three teams.

For Skaven, it would go on a gutter runner and for Underworld it'd go on a mutated goblin, and there's just better skills I'd want a double in both cases. Perhaps on a second double for a ball retriever gutter runner.

For Vampires, well, they start with nothing so those skill slots are precious and to be filled with basic skills, mostly, as I see them. But it could be good on one, it's true - if the other required roles are filled.

[Raveen]

Nerves is a great example, and funnily enough one that dovetails with Dump Off. If you go down the route of making a Dark Elf Runner a Dump Off specialist then NoS is a great pick because whenever dump off is used the runner is in at least one tacklezone.

Thick Skull - I would never ever pick this. It's just not worth it. But on Khemri Skeletons in particular it's a godsend because it keeps those players on the pitch.

[notjarvis]

I suppose Horns is one that you would rarely pick, as it's restricted to the blitzing player, and getting it for a single player restricts your team somewhat..

But on the Chaos team, having the ability for any of the beastmen to blitz at ST4 is a pretty awesome and greatly increases your tactical options.

[lawastooshort]

I think Horns depends on the team, NJ.

I would possibly take it on a second double on my Skaven killer blitzer IF I didn't like Jump Up a lot more.

I would take it on an Underworld killer blitzer (as a normal) after the other 4 required killer skills (but have not done so far).

I would absolutely take it on an Underworld goblin - as the next skill on any gobbo who already had Wrestle, and generally on other "suitable" gobbos once the more important skills are taken care of. I have it on two goblins in my UKBBL team who don't have Wrestle, and it is amazing.


But I totally agree it's not worth having on too many players due to the blitzing limit.

[Gandalf]

Nurgle have Horns on some players too (though they cost 20k more for the same stat line.... grumble grumble). It's nice to have.

la - I see your point for NoS, Skaven are more a running side than passing side, and with mutation access I can see wanting to use doubles on other things. Vampires can be built almost any way, so why not NoS if you want to be a bit crazy? I'm sure it would get some use.

Pro - It will be going on my AG4 ogre if I get a double; he does so many rolls for so many different things, the extra half a re-roll will be great. I've read it's a decent choice on any Big Guy's second double as it helps with nega-traits, or on blitzers (at some point after getting block) as you can increase the chance of getting the player over. I've only seen it on 1 amazon player in RTBBL.

Hail Mary Pass - I think Abom is planning this for his bombardier. That said I think it's would make for a decent backup option on lots of teams, a bit like Throw Team-Mate. It probably won't work but sometimes it's nice to have >0% chance of scoring in the time remaining. Perhaps on a team less gifted at passing... AG4 players with pass can do long passes on 4+ with a reroll (75% chance) so less appealing for them.

[lawastooshort]

I think there is a cyanide HMP bug, can't remember the details...

Many Vampire coaches seem to like to Pro. I don't. Except on a dedicated Hynogazer. Nothing where failure to get the reroll adds to the risk of turnover.

I can see the appeal on a Big Guy after Block and would consider it. Never had a Big Guy roll a double though...

[lawastooshort]

Oh - NoS on a Vampire. Yes, it would get some use, especially for a team based on getting the ball free... But there's 3 skills I'd want first on every Vampire so it would be a bit of a luxury I think. You don't get many Vampires to have many luxury choices

[Raveen]

http://www.thenaf.net/2016/03/low-tier- ... s-greener/

I had no idea when I started this thread but Trumpkin from Anything But A One (a weekly BB podcast by the Bristol TT BB group, they don't have our production values ) has written an article on a similar bent.

Pro on Negatrait players is a good call IMO. It makes the player actmore than 90% of the time compared to 83% without it. And it has the added bonus on big guys of rerolling blocks if needed (not for turnovers but pushes). I wouldn't take it on anyone else though because it's an unreliable reroll. So a leaper for example, I'd rather save a TRR for that roll.

HMP - great double on a bomber. Lacking in utility on anyone else. I'd maybe like to see HMP rolled in with kick because it acts like a kick in rugby terms. That might see it used a bit more often to defensively punt the ball into space and avoid a turnover touchdown.

[Gandalf]

I still think Pro on Blitzers/killers could be worth it, for rerolling pushes. The other thing is that it effectively gives you max 1.5 rerolls a turn instead of max 1. It could be useful for passing moves for that reason, especially AG3 teams who are naturally less good at it.

As chief passer of RTBBL (teams with most passing yards = Everglades 1st, Shrek 3rd soon to be 2nd) I approve of that post. With so few teams/coaches regularly trying long passes it's not surprising no-one has ever taken Pass Block, the only time I faced it was earlier this season when Rav had a start player with it. Safe Throw has saved many a turn from disaster.

I can see the appeal on a Big Guy after Block and would consider it. Never had a Big Guy roll a double though...

I was going to point out that I hadn't either, but then I realised I've only had 4 level-ups on Big Guys, so it's not massively surprising. I've rolled more 11's for Ogres than I have doubles....

[Raveen]

Pass Block isn't worth it because passing is so rare in BB. Maybe in an all Elf league?

I've probably rolled more skill ups than anyone on big guys than anyone else in the league (which is odd because I usually don't rate them) and got block twice. It makes them amazing players and whilst pro might be nice, I don't see it being that much of a game changer. On a second doubles on a BG I'd be tempted by dodge tbh, particularly on the Av8 ones.

[lawastooshort]

Yes I'd rather a Block Dodge Big Guy than Pro.